BT Wholesale checker changes

[Some Edinburgh Guy]

So I was just having a look on the BT Wholesale broadband availability checker and noticed there has been a change to the information that is now displayed here. This appears to be a very recent change, as I checked this only a week or so ago and it wasn't displaying things like this.

It now appears that if you are able to receive a VDSL (SOGEA) service, no matter what speed it is (even if its just 10mbps), you can no longer request an ADSL service. The available checker now ONLY reports the VDSL speeds if that technology can be provisioned at a location, and you can no longer see ADSL speeds, even if you could theoretically receive that service. Properties which are too far to receive VDSL service and don't have FTTP will still display the ADSL speeds, but that only seems to be relevant to very rural areas that are too far from the DSLAM they are connected to. I have to assume BT Wholesale are now in the process of a phased withdrawal of ADSL in some form?

To demonstrate this: my address below shows the change to the checker (as you can see, no FTTP is available here, and this is not an FTTP Priority Exchange, but the SOADSL restriction isn't set to Y yet, perhaps that will happen soon). I checked a number of other properties I used to live at in the past, and they're all lacking ADSL speeds as well, including a house which can only get a max of 11mbps on FTTC:

 

[Pixelpetal]

I can also confirm, shows the same here

 

[insertfloppydiskhere]

Can only pray FTTP comes eventually

 

[xEl-Capitanx]

Theres a reason SOSADL is called SOTAP - Single Order Transitional Access Product...

SOTAP Technology Overview | Next-Generation Internet Connectivity Technology | LineBroker

SOTAP explained in more depth - call Linebroker on 01883 770 352 to purchase.

linebroker.co.uk

 

[Some Edinburgh Guy]

Theres a reason SOSADL is called SOTAP - Single Order Transitional Access Product...

SOTAP Technology Overview | Next-Generation Internet Connectivity Technology | LineBroker

SOTAP explained in more depth - call Linebroker on 01883 770 352 to purchase.

linebroker.co.uk

You're confusing the SOTAP product against the generic SOADL service, they are not the same thing. SOADSL is ADSL with a Digital Voice phone service: SOTAP is a simulated PSTN service using DV, but which the end customer doesn't have to change anything in their home set up (ie they still connect their phone to the wall socket, not their router). SOTAP isn't available for people to order, but SOADSL can be ordered as its the basic broadband-only service.

People who can't get VDSL/SOGA (either due to being too far away from the cabinet, or because the cabinet is full) should be getting SOADSL as a bare minimum, but it looks like BT Wholesale no longer allow provisioning SOADSL either for people who are within range of a VDSL service (which implies those customers who are on a full cabinet can't get any broadband at all)

 

[xEl-Capitanx]

Oh dear

SOTAP and SOADSL are basically that same thing

Beginner’s Guide to Broadband - Giacom

Broadband is a service that enables a customer to connect to the internet over a shared fixed infrastructure in the ground. It is an asymmetrical service, meaning that the download speed is greater than the upload speed. At the customer’s premises, a modem or wireless router solution provides...

giacom.com

I provision and fix daily. I also have been on a number of Openreach sessions where they state this

(Unless Im really missing something - And I mean something really really obvious from Openreach since my last training 3 months ago)

 

[LeakedOne]

Seems to have happened overnight, ADSL was showing yesterday

 

[Some Edinburgh Guy]

Oh dear

SOTAP and SOADSL are basically that same thing

View attachment 16073

Beginner’s Guide to Broadband - Giacom

Broadband is a service that enables a customer to connect to the internet over a shared fixed infrastructure in the ground. It is an asymmetrical service, meaning that the download speed is greater than the upload speed. At the customer’s premises, a modem or wireless router solution provides...

giacom.com

I provision and fix daily. I also have been on a number of Openreach sessions where they state this

(Unless Im really missing something - And I mean something really really obvious from Openreach since my last training 3 months ago)

I just realised SOTAP is the name of the SOADSL service and I was wrongly conflating it against SOTAP for Analogue. Personally it makes more sense to use SOADSL to mean the modern ADSL service, and SOTAP for the simulated PSTN service, but that is relatively immaterial as ADSL is legacy tech anyway. My mistake.

 

[xEl-Capitanx]

I just realised SOTAP is the name of the SOADSL service and I was wrongly conflating it against SOTAP for Analogue. Personally it makes more sense to use SOADSL to mean the modern ADSL service, and SOTAP for the simulated PSTN service, but that is relatively immaterial as ADSL is legacy tech anyway. My mistake.

Its alright haha - I tend to find OR is very closed door unless you work in the industry and then getting info from them is like getting blood from a stone... ¬_¬

 

[Some Edinburgh Guy]

Nah don't worry, I'm sure plenty of people have the same confusion!!

One thing I don't understand is why the checker also lists G.Fast for properties who can't receive this service (like mine), would make more sense to hide that off too, but its not like it has much of a future anyway and was just Openreach sweating the copper assets before they decided to go for FTTP lol

Hopefully the database updates to flag SOADSL Restriction = Y for all these properties/exchanges in the next couple of days.

 

[i.h]

Just tried it for an address where VDSL is unavailable because the cabinet is full - and indeed it shows SOADSL as an option.

Makes sense. It's an exchange based service, the DSLAMs have been effectively obsolete for years, and there are inefficiencies and differences from VDSL/FTTP (for example, all BT ADSL services are ATM based even though the core network has been Ethernet for some time - the DSLAM does the conversion).

No point allowing new customers / cheapskate CPs to use it if they can get something more modern.

 

[Some Edinburgh Guy]

Just tried it for an address where VDSL is unavailable because the cabinet is full - and indeed it shows SOADSL as an option.

Makes sense. It's an exchange based service, the DSLAMs have been effectively obsolete for years, and there are inefficiencies and differences from VDSL/FTTP (for example, all BT ADSL services are ATM based even though the core network has been Ethernet for some time - the DSLAM does the conversion).

No point allowing new customers / cheapskate CPs to use it if they can get something more modern.

I agree. I do wonder if BT Wholesale (via BT Group's pages) will announce that the ADSL service is now effectively withdrawn for anyone who can receive VDSL (exc FTTP since thats a different thing). I suggest this because I think ISP's base their available products off the Wholesale checker results, so not seeing SOADSL might be confusing

Personal thoughts below, as a result of this post, as I wanted to extend this into another discussion, since its semi-related to the hiding of SOADSL products from the checker....

I do have to wonder when the small number of customers who are staunchly sticking to ADSL (as there are obviously people out there who can get VDSL and won't upgrade for whatever reason) when they can receive VDSL will be forcibly migrated to a 40/10 VDSL service as a bare minimum, until such a time as they move to FTTP, so as to completely remove the ADSL product from all but the most remote of locations....

To put it another way, my thought process would be something like this, to expedite the removal of the ADSL tech stack....
- If you are currently receiving an ADSL Max service but you can receive ADSL2+, you will be moved to ADSL2+. This leads to the complete decommissioning of ADSL Max (7.15mbps download, 0.36mbps upload maximum), no matter what your exchange distance is. (I think I read somewhere the policy of BT was not to move people to ADSL2+ if their speed wasn't above ADSL Max, but i doubt thats enforced now)
- If you are on ADSL2+ but you are connected to a cabinet that has VDSL and there is a spare port available for you to receive the service, you are moved to a 40/10 VDSL product. This will still leave a number of ADSL2+ customers, but once they're migrated and the number of ADSL2+ customers is insignificant, ADSL2+ can be completely decommissioned, allowing the removal of the copper connection from cabinets to exchange and all exchange-related equipment to serve broadband (in this vein, the only broadband service would be VDSL or .

Of course, a customer can only be on VDSL if there is a spare port for them in the DSLAM cabinet. If there are no spare ports, an ADSL2+ customer wouldn't be migrated until a port became free: naturally, a port is unlikely to be free unless there is FTTP for VDSL customers to move to, as Openreach don't build new FTTC cabinets any more.

Eventually, I think we can all agree the goal of Openreach is to have 100% FTTP across the country, so no copper anywhere, which would obviously lead to the decommissioning and removal of all cabinets, which is the obvious outcome to an FTTP rollout.

Thoughts?

 

[WKDRED]

This wont be surprising.

I checked my address, as my address has no OR FTTP plans and the exchange is planned to survive as well, so was curious if it was just tied in with exchanges that plan to be removed. But ADSL isnt there.

I think if OR was planning 100% everywhere, then they could just remove the FTTP checker and do a generic announcement of by 2030 everywhere, I dont think they going to do it everywhere. The checker reports no plans here. I actually even think they wont even do the announced build continuation all the way to 2030, at some point as is extremely common in the telecoms industry they will announce the investment money cant be spent anymore. For same reason Cityfibre wont hit their target as well as other alt nets.

 

[candlerb]

If BT have decided to withdraw this for everyone who can get VDSL or FTTP, but still make it available for those on EO lines or where the VDSL cabinet is full, that sounds like a very sensible move to me. The service needs to wither away and die.

Remember this is only BT Wholesale we're talking about; other providers like Talktalk and Sky can still provide ADSL from their own in-exchange DSLAMs and MSANs over LLU. Presumably they will also stop selling this at some point in the future, if they haven't done so already. But since their MSANs are also providing analogue voice service, I would expect they would be retained at least until OR withdraw their analogue voice (WLR) service, now pushed back to Jan 2027.

 

[i.h]

Presumably they will also stop selling this at some point in the future, if they haven't done so already. But since their MSANs are also providing analogue voice service, I would expect they would be retained at least until OR withdraw their analogue voice (WLR) service, now pushed back to Jan 2027.

I believe this date only applies to the PSTN as we know it. It's also clear that BT are working on this "pre digital phone line" stuff (ie VoIP based but from exchange equipment - which is essentially how the LLU firms do it already, and how BT originally intended to do it in the late 2000s) which can persist until the exchange itself is closed later on.

 

[candlerb]

I believe this date only applies to the PSTN as we know it.

Yes that's right. But the other operators with analogue voice still need to decide commercially how long it's still viable to provide, and in any case will have to turn it off as part of exchange closure in the 2030's.

The commercial viability includes the cost of hosting and operating their ADSL/MSAN equipment in local exchanges, when more and more customers are going to FTTC or FTTP.

It's also clear that BT are working on this "pre digital phone line" stuff (ie VoIP based but from exchange equipment

Also true. However this "SOTAP for analogue" product will *only* be provided to users of analogue PSTN with *no broadband* service; and it will not be available for new sale, only for existing customers.

Anyone who has broadband, even ADSL, will be required to move to digital voice (if they take voice at all)

 

[insertfloppydiskhere]

Can only pray FTTP comes eventually

View attachment 16072

I should add that I seem to only be able to get ADSL, I think my local cabinet can do FTTC but I think I'm too far away from it?

Just wanted to add that given the article: https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.p...e-adsl-results-from-uk-broadband-checker.html

 

[Some Edinburgh Guy]

I should add that I seem to only be able to get ADSL, I think my local cabinet can do FTTC but I think I'm too far away from it?

Just wanted to add that given the article: https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.p...e-adsl-results-from-uk-broadband-checker.html

Your adsl speeds show you are very close to the exchange (Up to 17, with a range of 10-19.5 is a pretty generic range for properties within one mile of their exchange, often it will be higher than the estimates depending on line quality), but you must be on an Exchange Only line, hence no FTTC service, as any adsl2+ service with speeds like yours would likely be getting at least 40mbps or more, depending on actual distance [ie, people 500m or less would get 80/20 easily]

i guess no local programme decided to do a rearrangement by putting a cabinet in front of the exchange to provide some FTTC service, but these are lines i would expect to be prioritised for FTTP.

 

[insertfloppydiskhere]

Your adsl speeds show you are very close to the exchange (Up to 17, with a range of 10-19.5 is a pretty generic range for properties within one mile of their exchange, often it will be higher than the estimates depending on line quality), but you must be on an Exchange Only line, hence no FTTC service, as any adsl2+ service with speeds like yours would likely be getting at least 40mbps or more, depending on actual distance [ie, people 500m or less would get 80/20 easily]

i guess no local programme decided to do a rearrangement by putting a cabinet in front of the exchange to provide some FTTC service, but these are lines i would expect to be prioritised for FTTP.

Other properties down the street have FTTC though, I think I have gotten an idea for a possible reason although it'll be dumb if that's the case since Virgin was installed fine

I think my local cabinet is less than half a mile from memory

 

[Some Edinburgh Guy]

Other properties down the street have FTTC though, I think I have gotten an idea for a possible reason although it'll be dumb if that's the case since Virgin was installed fine

I think my local cabinet is less than half a mile from memory

At the top of your checker entry, does it just say “on Exchange NAMEOFEXCHANGE” or does it say “on Exchange NAMEOFEXCHANGE is served by Cabinet XXX”? If its the former, your line doesn’t use a cabinet and is connected all the way to the exchange directly, but other houses might well have been connected to the cabinet at build or they are served from a different distribution route that your property doesn’t use when your line was set up.

sadly thats no consolation as it means you will not get VDSL service, since Openreach have basically abandoned the idea of adding new cabinets or conducting line rearrangements.