Review
Pop Culture Happy Hour
Review
Pop Culture Happy Hour
(SOUNDBITE OF MUSIC)
STEPHEN THOMPSON, HOST:
The new movie "MaXXXine" - that's "MaXXXine" with three Xs - stars Mia Goth as an adult film actress who gets her big break in Hollywood only to be revisited by horrors from her past. It's the final film in a beloved horror trilogy that began with "X" just two years ago. I'm Stephen Thompson, and today we are talking about "MaXXXine" on POP CULTURE HAPPY HOUR from NPR.
Joining me today is NPR producer Mark Rivers. Hey, Mark.
MARC RIVERS, BYLINE: Good to see you.
THOMPSON: Also with us - Jordan Crucchiola. She is a writer and producer and the host of the wonderful podcast "Feeling Seen" on the wonderful Maximum Fun. Hey, Jordan.
JORDAN CRUCCHIOLA: Hello. Thank you so much for having me back.
THOMPSON: It is such a pleasure to reconvene the panel we had to talk about "X"...
RIVERS: "X" reunion.
THOMPSON: ...Two years ago.
RIVERS: Coming full circle.
THOMPSON: (Laughter) Alright, well, this franchise has been jumping around chronologically. The first movie, "X," was set in the late '70s as it depicted a group of young, hot people as they try to make a porno movie only to get slaughtered one by one by an elderly couple in a remote farmhouse. A prequel called "Pearl" came out just a few months later and gave us that elderly couple's bloody origin story. Now "MaXXXine" is set in 1985, six years after the grisly events of "X." The actress Maxine Minx, again played by Mia Goth, is now in LA, where she works in adult entertainment and tries to break into mainstream acting.
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "MAXXXINE")
MIA GOTH: (As Maxine Minx) Realistically, porn can only take me so far. I'm gonna be 33 years old pretty soon, and in hardcore, women age like bread, not wine. I'm not where I want to be yet. I want the good life.
THOMPSON: Maxine seems to get her big break when she's cast in the sequel to an "Exorcist"-style horror movie that has drawn the attention of religious protesters. She feels pressure to make the most of the rare opportunity she's given, but Maxine has got bigger problems as her friends start getting killed, and she's visited by a sleazy private detective who knows about Maxine's bloody past. He's played by Kevin Bacon, who's pouring on a Southern drawl.
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "MAXXXINE")
KEVIN BACON: (As John Labat) Ain't you that dirty movie actress? Well, you look a whole lot taller in person. I guess I only ever seen you lying on your back.
THOMPSON: And because "MaXXXine" is set in 1985 Los Angeles, there's also the small matter of the real-life serial killer known as the Night Stalker, whose actions may or may not be central to the threats that Maxine and her friends face. "MaXXXine" was written and directed by Ti West, who also made "X" and "Pearl." It's in theaters now. Jordan, I know you to be a big fan of Ti West's movies. What did you think of this one?
CRUCCHIOLA: "X" is the strongest of the trilogy for me, still. It is my favorite one of the Mia Goth trio. This one was built for me in that it has all the components that would appeal to me most as an individual, Jordan Crucchiola. I don't think it is as tight as the prior two movies that come before it, but I think that those ingredients altogether still make for a delicious milkshake that I had a lot of fun consuming. Some little hitches in the giddyap at the end for me, but the star power of this cast - I feel like everybody in their roles delivered exactly how I wanted them to. And Mia Goth - truly a defining weirdo genre figure of our age.
THOMPSON: A scream queen.
RIVERS: Major showcase.
THOMPSON: Yeah.
CRUCCHIOLA: Major showcase, major showcase.
RIVERS: And it's funny, Stephen, you know, you say scream queen. I think what's refreshing about Ti West and Mia Goth's take on the so-called scream queen is she doesn't do a lot screaming in this movie. You know...
THOMPSON: No.
RIVERS: ...She is kind of the one who feels most in command. It's often a very silent performance, and I appreciate that kind of remixing of what we associate with the term scream queen. She is often scary.
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "MAXXXINE")
GOTH: (As Maxine) Drop it, Buster.
(SOUNDBITE OF OBJECT FALLING)
GOTH: (As Maxine) What were you gonna do, huh?
ZACHARY MOOREN: (As character) Nothing. I was just playing around.
GOTH: (As Maxine) Well, we're playing now.
RIVERS: As far as how I feel about "MaXXXine," I agree with Jordan. I think "X" is definitely the strongest of the three. I think it had - if obvious - the best overall conceit, you know, taking one type of film - the adult film - to comment upon, you know, the horror film. "MaXXXine," to me, I think is - it's the least satisfying of the trilogy, if I had to say.
With all three of these movies, Ti West has been riffing on films of the eras that they take place in, right? "X" kind of riffing on '70s pictures, "Pearl" kind of riffs on technicolor extravaganzas and kind of finds the sick underbelly underneath those things. Here, we're in the '80s, and there's kind of a danger to doing pastiche work the way West does. I mean, he's talked about some of the films that he's been thinking of when he made this film. James Cameron's "The Terminator, Paul Schrader's "Hardcore." I also thought of Brian De Palma movies.
CRUCCHIOLA: Yeah, "Body Double" feels like it's, like, all over this movie.
RIVERS: All over, from plot to, you know, filmmaking - I thought about William Friedkin's "Cruising," even. It kind of makes you want to watch those movies instead. And I think that's kind of what I felt like when I was watching this film. I said, why am I watching this guy's sampling of Brian De Palma when I can just watch "Dressed To Kill" or watch "Body Double.".
And I think something about those past works in the '80s is that there was this charge of transgression in those films. It was taking you places that you shouldn't go to, and that - or that it was looking where you shouldn't look. And I just didn't feel much of a charge with this film. It felt more so that here is this kind of film savant kind of using the '80s as a kind of playground. And that can be fun too, but I don't really know how much that amounts to ultimately. And.
I think "X," I think, had a little bit more to say about what we want from that genre in particular and what we expect from it, who's disposable, who gets to be the survivor in that movie. And with "MaXXXine"...
THOMPSON: Yeah.
RIVERS: ...I don't know if it amounted to as much as the last two movies did.
THOMPSON: That's interesting 'cause I take something you're describing as a weakness, which is the pastiche of so many maybe superior pieces of filmmaking - I'd actually take that as a little bit of a strength. My one knock on a movie like "X" - a movie I enjoyed a lot, a movie I think is a really terrific horror movie - what it is riffing on is pretty contained and pretty familiar. It - "X" is riffing on a lot of, like, "Texas Chain Saw Massacre"-style - there is a group of hot randos, and we watch them get eviscerated.
RIVERS: Vividly embodied randos, though.
THOMPSON: Yes - until one remains. And to me, like, it's stretching the boundaries of that, and it's commenting on things beyond that. But at its heart, it's really just, like, a pretty streamlined, bloody horror movie about porn. And this film is, I think, reaching for more. I agree with Jordan that it has some pretty significant third-act issues, some issues with its resolution that I found a little bit, like, whuh (ph)? I don't know about that. How would that work?
CRUCCHIOLA: Yeah. It's hard to stick a landing in any horror movie. It's hard to stick...
THOMPSON: Yeah.
CRUCCHIOLA: ...The landing of something that wraps up, like, a three-movie span, especially after you've gone, like, I'm going to go genre hopping, and I'm going to have, like, a little, like, auteur's playground in sort of each one of these things. It was a cool and ambitious effort as it leaned toward - at the same time, I think A24 getting into more of a populist appeal as opposed to, like, a more sort of strictly refined genre appeal in its arthouse stuff. A lot rides on a big bad. And for me, this big bad and how that played out...
THOMPSON: Yeah.
CRUCCHIOLA: ...Didn't totally sing to me.
RIVERS: Yeah.
CRUCCHIOLA: But again, the components were in place for my very solid enjoyment the entire time.
RIVERS: And I don't know about you two, but I knew the big bad from, I think, the first few seconds. And I'm not saying...
THOMPSON: (Laughter).
RIVERS: ...I don't think I'm the smartest moviegoer. I'm along for the ride...
(LAUGHTER)
RIVERS: ... I'm not, like, trying to predict each plot element, but it didn't zag where I thought it would zig, the way I think the last two movies were. I think this felt more kind of, like, just a standard slasher - I mean, the kind of slasher that we would have seen in the '80s with maybe a better protagonist, you know, a less of a victim as a protagonist.
THOMPSON: I don't know. I'm going to keep pushing back. For one, I think when we're talking about the protagonist here, I want to piggyback on something Jordan said at the top of the segment, which is this Mia Goth performance is so electric.
CRUCCHIOLA: I'm there. I'm there with you.
RIVERS: Yeah, yeah, agreed.
THOMPSON: She is such a strong presence. She is such an inversion of so much about the typical final girl horror movie heroine. She gives as good as she gets. One touch in this film that I admired so much is that, you know, she's an adult film star trying to make it as a, quote-unquote, "legitimate actress," and they make her a good actress.
CRUCCHIOLA: Yeah. Yeah. I like that.
THOMPSON: You see her in an audition, and she's phenomenal.
CRUCCHIOLA: The first 10 minutes of this movie are some of my favorite first 10 minutes of any movie in a while. I think it's the strongest opener of any. That Maxine walking into the audition is fire.
THOMPSON: Yeah. And for me, a lot of the appeal of that first scene carried through the film a little bit more. Once it gets into the resolution, it starts to lose me. It starts to get more conventional...
RIVERS: Yeah.
THOMPSON: ...And I don't think it really added up, logically.
RIVERS: Yeah. It's almost like once the plot actually gets going, it kind of almost loses me. Like, that beginning and just, like, you know, our kind of entrance into this '80s industry, you know, the music scene, "St. Elmo's Fire" on the marquee - you're just, like, cool. This is great. I'm in. Let's just be in this world. And I think once, like, the plot gear started, like, kicking in was where I kind of started sitting back and saying, OK, well, I'm along for the ride now, but less immersed than I was at the start of it.
But I agree Mia Goth is doing something, I think, really compelling with all three of these movies here. I think there's, like, an opaqueness to her, where, like, you can't read her at all times, but also there's a restless kind of energy behind her too. You can kind of see her just be so in these scenes. You can imagine Sissy Spacek could have given that performance, but if they had given her more roles where she was in control - instead of kind of being at the mercies of her powers, she took control of her powers. That's what Mia Goth embodies to me, is, like, I'm taking control of my feminist energies and wiles.
CRUCCHIOLA: A thing I really love about this movie - like, all three of them have excelled so well in their aesthetic - I feel like unimpeachably so. And what was really refreshing about this, from a time when we are so surrounded by '80s homage and '80s invocations...
THOMPSON: Yes.
CRUCCHIOLA: ...And '80s stylings, it doesn't feel like the very sterilized Jazzercize version of the '80s...
(LAUGHTER)
CRUCCHIOLA: ...That has become...
THOMPSON: No.
CRUCCHIOLA: Yeah, like...
THOMPSON: It's the scuzzy...
CRUCCHIOLA: ...The triangles and squiggly lines.
THOMPSON: It's the scuzzy '80s.
RIVERS: It's grimy.
THOMPSON: Yeah.
CRUCCHIOLA: Exactly. It really is, like, sleazy '80s. It feels like the Hollywood Boulevard of watching the "Angel" trilogy, where there really was that, like, red-light-district quality to it. And I feel like the '80s is the era currently where it's most likely to kind of, like, suffer from too much pastiche and too much homage 'cause you're like, oh, my God, we've seen it. We know it.
But I had just had a conversation with a filmmaker friend right before I saw it, where he was, like, is it possible to actually do an '80s period piece without it being kitschy? And then I walk into...
RIVERS: Right.
CRUCCHIOLA: ..."Maxxxine, " and I was like, well, damn, I think it is because I think...
THOMPSON: (Laughter).
CRUCCHIOLA: ...It's "Maxxxine."
THOMPSON: I think I just saw it.
RIVERS: Yeah.
THOMPSON: It's interesting - to piggyback on something you said a minute ago, Marc, about the Mia Goth character having a different kind of agency than we're accustomed to seeing, I think that really worked well with this setting. And it also gave a different feeling to the typical bad decision-making that takes place in horror movies. The inversion that's going on in this role - like, she makes bad decisions, but they are made out of aggression.
RIVERS: Yeah.
THOMPSON: They are made out of a certain way that she moves through the world. And I think that that fits really well with the time and place - fits really well with the other films. I did want to ask you guys - speaking of the other films, for people who might be interested in seeing this movie but haven't seen "X" or "Pearl," do you think that people need to do homework before seeing this film?
CRUCCHIOLA: I think it is the least standalone of the three...
RIVERS: Yeah.
CRUCCHIOLA: ...And it's saddled with the fact that it has to be a resolution. My only sort of, like, what-if thing that I kind of go on about this one was, like, what if it did try to totally stand alone, and it was just, like, now we're just going to follow "Maxxxine," but we're not going to make this about the throughline of what happened after "X, " but it's just going to be the totally different tale of a star trying to come up in the industry? But I...
RIVERS: Yeah.
CRUCCHIOLA: ...Think in order for it to feel as rewarding about Mia, I feel like the interiority that she brings to a part in a movie like this, I feel like it is stronger in knowing what's come before it, whereas, perhaps, that opacity might be too thick for somebody who was brand-new to it 'cause she might seem unreadable to the point of, like...
THOMPSON: Yeah.
CRUCCHIOLA: ...Listen, girl, why don't you just tell the police...
RIVERS: Yeah.
THOMPSON: (Laughter).
CRUCCHIOLA: ...What's - like, the Night Stalker's out there. Where this one fits to me as its unique great coolness that sets it apart from the other ones - "X" is an ensemble. "Pearl" is a...
THOMPSON: Yeah.
CRUCCHIOLA: ...Standalone piece, and this is, like, a cast-of-characters movie.
THOMPSON: Yes.
CRUCCHIOLA: This is my favorite Lily Collins performance as this actress in this movie. Elizabeth Debicki not only getting to be tall, but getting to wear...
THOMPSON: (Laughter).
CRUCCHIOLA: ...Boots that make her even taller...
THOMPSON: Even taller.
RIVERS: Yeah.
CRUCCHIOLA: ...Yeah, playing an exploitation movie director who's, like, I want to make a B movie with an A message.
THOMPSON: Which is a pretty meta to say in a Ti West movie.
CRUCCHIOLA: Yes, and just, like, icy-cold, like, '80s feminist - and, like, Kevin Bacon is feasting on every scene.
RIVERS: He's putting ketchup, mustard and relish...
THOMPSON: (Laughter).
RIVERS: ...On the Southern accent here.
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "MAXXXINE")
BACON: (As John Labat) Well, that right there - that's privileged information. My employer would prefer to reveal it hisself. He's got a - how do I say this? - a flair for the dramatic.
CRUCCHIOLA: You can smell Kevin Bacon in this movie.
RIVERS: Yeah.
THOMPSON: You can also smell Giancarlo Esposito.
CRUCCHIOLA: He was eating up. He was eating up every scene.
RIVERS: I was so happy to see him, but I also was totally baffled. Yeah, he's got a wisp...
THOMPSON: (Laughter).
RIVERS: ...Of a blonde toupee going on.
THOMPSON: Yeah.
CRUCCHIOLA: Yes.
THOMPSON: Moses Sumney has a remarkable screen presence.
CRUCCHIOLA: Moses Sumney as the GBF - and Michelle Monaghan anywhere - I don't get enough Michelle Monaghan in my life in any capacity.
THOMPSON: Yeah.
CRUCCHIOLA: Bobby Cannavale - is there anybody who can do more with a shorter amount of...
RIVERS: Delightful.
CRUCCHIOLA: ...Screen time than that guy?
THOMPSON: (Laughter).
CRUCCHIOLA: Like, I love the little drop-ins throughout this movie. And I was looking forward to each new person who I was going to meet throughout it because each person was such a satisfying delivery when they got there.
RIVERS: West drops into this world - this era of a kind of, like, puritanical takeover, it seems - right? - and, like, this kind of moral panic. And I...
THOMPSON: Yeah.
RIVERS: ...What I do appreciate about this cast of characters is that everyone we meet is, some way or another, a creep or a freak...
CRUCCHIOLA: Yes.
THOMPSON: (Laughter).
RIVERS: ...Whether it's the guard who really appreciates Maxine's previous line of work...
CRUCCHIOLA: Yeah.
RIVERS: ...Or, you know, it's the Night Stalker himself - real-life serial killer who was operating at that time. Like, everyone we meet is, in some way, kind of gross, kind of disgusting.
THOMPSON: Yeah. It is not a movie that is super optimistic about Hollywood...
CRUCCHIOLA: (Laughter).
THOMPSON: ...As a place (laughter).
CRUCCHIOLA: And I do like how much Maxine never conforms to the ascent of the final girl. Maxine is always out for herself. And I didn't need Maxine to become my hero. I can love Maxine as my antihero.
RIVERS: And she didn't really try to be likable, you know? I don't think...
CRUCCHIOLA: No.
RIVERS: ...She was asking us to like her in any way. That is rare for kind of the horror genre, where they either have to be pure or if they're not going to be likable, they will be offed.
CRUCCHIOLA: Yeah. And even now where we've come around more to unlikability - we can accept more texture in a heroine - there generally is kind of, like, an empowerment statement at some point, even if she doesn't become a girl's girl or something like that or altruistic.
THOMPSON: Right.
CRUCCHIOLA: Maxine is still, like, a profit-motivated capitalist who, like, refuses to accept a life she does not deserve.
THOMPSON: Right. She is a brawler.
CRUCCHIOLA: She's a brawler.
THOMPSON: She is a survivor. I think, if nothing else, we can all agree that this movie gives you a lot to talk about.
CRUCCHIOLA: Yes.
RIVERS: Absolutely.
CRUCCHIOLA: I feel like it is sumptuous to be immersed in.
RIVERS: And just what a gift, honestly, you know, in this world of franchises and IP that we have a trilogy made of three original screenplays. That's something to celebrate. No matter how you feel overall about the films, I think it's really cool that West has kind of put this together and accomplished this.
CRUCCHIOLA: Absolutely.
THOMPSON: All right. Well, we want to know what you think about "MaXXXine." Find us on Facebook at facebook.com/pchh. Up next, What Is Making Us Happy This Week?
Now it's time for our favorite segment of this week and every week, What's Making Us Happy This Week? Jordan Crucchiola, kick us off.
CRUCCHIOLA: We are just a few days removed from the end of Pride Month. Pride Month should never end. It should be 12 months long.
(LAUGHTER)
CRUCCHIOLA: But as such, I just have to say that lesbian cinema is what is making me happy this week.
RIVERS: (Laughter).
CRUCCHIOLA: I was recently on a podcast dedicated to ranking works of lesbian cinema. And, you guys, from "The Children's Hour" to "Bottoms"...
THOMPSON: Yeah.
CRUCCHIOLA: ...We have covered so much ground. We are not just crying. We are not just processing. We are not just tragic, even though all those things are canonically lesbian. Shouts out to the ages of lesbian cinema, the durability of movies like "The Watermelon Woman" and "Desert Hearts" and the new vim and vigor in movies like "Love Lies Bleeding" and, once again, the queer authorship behind movies like "Bottoms" and that aforementioned title. So, yeah, lesbian cinema generally is making me very happy this week. Get out there, and get into the archives, and revel in the history, everybody.
RIVERS: And you don't just need Pride Month for that. We can do that all year, you know?
CRUCCHIOLA: All year, all year - but, like, what a better occasion.
(LAUGHTER)
THOMPSON: Wonderful. Thank you, Jordan Crucchiola. Marc Rivers, what's making you happy this week?
RIVERS: This is a tad more bleak, but it is making me happy. I'm getting into the book "Chain-Gang All-Stars." This book came out last year. It's the debut novel from the author Nana Kwame Adjei-Brenyah. He was last known for a collection of short stories called "Friday Black." And you can kind of think of that collection as, you know, "Black Mirror"-esque stories, though instead of technology being the scary thing, it's racism and capitalism being the scary thing. And that's kind of the case with "Chain-Gang All-Stars." You know, imagine the author of "The New Jim Crow" making a screenplay that ties together "Gladiator" and "The Hunger Games," and you kind of have an idea of...
THOMPSON: Oh, wow.
RIVERS: ...What this book is about. And it takes place in this dystopia where those who've committed kind of heinous crimes like rape or murder can have their sentence gotten rid of if they participate in kind of gladiatorial fights for the entertainment of the masses. And I think this author is one of those people that you go to for these really great ideas, and it's a world that really kind of speaks to now as far as how both crime and punishment be commodified in our world. And when you have prisons that are for profit, that can lead to unspeakable abuses, and this is a really great book with some wonderful rich characters, and I'm getting through it very quickly. It's a really quick read. So what's making me happy this week is "Chain-Gang All-Stars" by Nana Kwame Adjei-Brenyah.
THOMPSON: Nice. Thank you, Marc Rivers. So my favorite album of this summer is "Brat" by the singer Charli XCX.
CRUCCHIOLA: Oh.
THOMPSON: The album came out about a month ago. It is everything I had hoped it would be, just wall-to-wall bangers. There is a track on "Brat" called "Girl, So Confusing," in which Charli XCX sings about a fellow pop star, someone who sends mixed signals. She's not sure if they love or hate each other. And internet sleuths who heard the song pretty quickly deduced that "Girl, So Confusing" was about Lorde. About two weeks after the release of "Brat," Charli XCX released a remix of the song called - and I quote - "The Girl, So Confusing Version With Lorde."
CRUCCHIOLA: It's wild that it happened. Like, how often do we get that immediate gratification?
THOMPSON: So quick. It takes the song, lets Charli XCX kind of tell her side of the story, and then it turns the song over to Lorde, who explains the situation from her perspective. And in one verse, she's touching on body issues, shame, jealousy, mental health, so much more. Let's hear just a little bit of it.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "THE GIRL, SO CONFUSING VERSION WITH LORDE")
LORDE: (Singing) For the last couple of years, I've been at war with my body. I tried to starve myself thinner, and then I gained all the weight back. I was trapped in the hatred, and your life seemed so awesome. I never thought for a second my voice was in your head.
THOMPSON: This song is such a welcome act of empathy, and I hope that it compels listeners to think about their own relationships, their own grievances, the same way. This song makes me appreciate Lorde more. It makes me appreciate Charli XCX more. It adds new depth to my favorite album of the summer that I just said, like, contains wall-to-wall bangers. So, there you go. "The Girl, So Confusing Version With Lorde" by Charli XCX - that, in addition to the album "Brat," is what is making me happy this week. If you want links for what we recommended, plus some more recommendations, sign up for our newsletter at npr.org/popculturenewsletter. That brings us to the end of our show. Marc Rivers, Jordan Crucchiola, thanks so much for being here.
RIVERS: Thanks for having me. It's a pleasure.
CRUCCHIOLA: Thank you so much for having me on.
THOMPSON: This episode was produced by Hafsa Fathima and Mike Katzif and edited by Jessica Reedy. Hello Come In provides our theme music. Thank you for listening to POP CULTURE HAPPY HOUR from NPR. I'm Stephen Thompson, and we will see you all next week.
(SOUNDBITE OF MUSIC)
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