I do not want macOS on iPad. Ever.

[Kahnforever]

The iPod wasn’t a video player. Until it was.

The iPad didn’t have stylus support. Until it did.

Macs don’t support touch. Until they do.

Not only is this a non-argument, it doesn’t even mean anything since the categories are not narrowly defined.



Even if this is true, it is entirely I. R. R. E. L. E. V. A. N. T for this discussion.

Did you not even read what you quoted, in this post? A more than casual workload on macOS hovers around 5W. This is NOTHING for an iPad.

Final Cut Pro, JavaScript and GPU-intense games should all be banned from the iPad if your logic is applied consistently, and macOS shouldn’t be allowed on the MacBook Air because the Mac Pro handles heat so much more effectively.

There are zero rational technical reasons to not allow macOS on an iPad. One could argue performance, but considering Apple still sold a Mac with a spinning disk in 2021, that argument doesn’t hold up very well.

We’re getting to absurdity again. The day the Mac becomes an iPad in functionality is the day it ceases to be a Mac.

 

[Arctic Moose]

We’re getting to absurdity again. The day the Mac becomes an iPad in functionality is the day it ceases to be a Mac.

Truly compelling argumentation, obviously based on insightful analysis, backed by hard data and eloquently presented! 👍

 

[Kahnforever]

Truly compelling argumentation, obviously based on insightful analysis, backed by hard data and eloquently presented! 👍

Pretty much every form of “laptop tablet” thing has been designed, built, marketed and sold. From the original convertible PC laptops to more modern versions like the Yoga or MS Surface laptop convertible.

Not only are they compromised as laptops and tablets given the increased weight and thickness, the software doesn’t work for touch.

I’m all for possibilities and new technologies. What we’re talking about here is the Mac getting a touchscreen. No, it won’t be a good iPad because it’s not designed to be that.

 

[Kal Madda]

Pretty much every form of “laptop tablet” thing has been designed, built, marketed and sold. From the original convertible PC laptops to more modern versions like the Yoga or MS Surface laptop convertible.

Not only are they compromised as laptops and tablets given the increased weight and thickness, the software doesn’t work for touch.

I’m all for possibilities and new technologies. What we’re talking about here is the Mac getting a touchscreen. No, it won’t be a good iPad because it’s not designed to be that.

And all of that is irrelevant to whether or not macOS, Windows, Linux, etc. could run in a VM app on the iPad Pro. If someone wanted to interact with these systems in a VM, they could do so just fine with an attached keyboard and mouse…

 

[Kahnforever]

And all of that is irrelevant to whether or not macOS, Windows, Linux, etc. could run in a VM app on the iPad Pro. If someone wanted to interact with these systems in a VM, they could do so just fine with an attached keyboard and mouse…

Why is it even a discussion running macOS in a VM on the iPad? Who cares what you or anybody else does in that regard.

 

[Kal Madda]

Why is it even a discussion running macOS in a VM on the iPad? Who cares what you or anybody else does in that regard.

That’s what others here are advocating for. Not a native port of macOS on the iPad, but the ability to run it in a VM. That’s at least what @Arctic Moose and several others in this discussion are advocating for.

 

[Kahnforever]

That’s what others here are advocating for. Not a native port of macOS on the iPad, but the ability to run it in a VM. That’s at least what @Arctic Moose and several others in this discussion are advocating for.

They should knock themselves out. At least they’d be on their own in that hellscape.

 

[Kal Madda]

They should knock themselves out. At least they’d be on their own in that hellscape.

The problem is that currently it’s difficult to run VMs on iPadOS. That’s why I think Apple should allow entitlements for developers to request access to for Hypervisor and JIT, both things that currently are lacking that prevent VMs from performing as well as they could otherwise. Apple allowing emulators may be promising for that possibility.

 

[yabeweb]

That is not so. I don’t care about Apple’s stock price.

I own lots of Apple products, and I bought an iPad Pro thinking I could edit photos with it, since that’s what Apple says it’s designed to do… and I’ve learned that it’s not nearly as good as my MacBook Pro at managing and editing RAW photos. I’ve tried Photoshop, Lightroom, and another RAW editor, and they’re basically a joke compared to the MacBook Pro and its software tools.

There’s nothing you can say that will change my mind on this point. I take RAW photo editing very seriously and I’ve done it for well over ten years now. I bought all of the products and use them extensively, and iPad just doesn’t cut it compared to a MacBook Pro or other Mac.

I don’t care how Apple improves these problems, I just want them fixed.

You are editing photos wrong then, about one of the best thing you can do on an iPad is photo editing.

 

[Alameda]

You are editing photos wrong then, about one of the best thing you can do on an iPad is photo editing.

What camera do you use?
What type of shooting do you do?
What is your workflow?

 

[Thomas Davie]

I do want MacOS on IPP 12.9 as a bootcamp type option. Sigh.

Tom

 

[Arctic Moose]

If developers wanted to, they could provide VM apps for iPadOS.

News on this front:

Michael Tsai - Blog - UTM Blocked Outside App Store via Notarization

(I think Apple is going to get in trouble for not allowing it on alternative app stores though.)

Also:

I remember the flash-in-the-pan moment where through some strange conflux of exp... | Hacker News

news.ycombinator.com

I remember the flash-in-the-pan moment where through some strange conflux of exploits and firmware features UTM on iOS was able to access full hardware virtualization support. It was a glorious glimpse into an alternate reality that we will likely never get to see again.

 

[Kal Madda]

News on this front:

Michael Tsai - Blog - UTM Blocked Outside App Store via Notarization

(I think Apple is going to get in trouble for not allowing it on alternative app stores though.)

Also:

I remember the flash-in-the-pan moment where through some strange conflux of exp... | Hacker News

news.ycombinator.com

Yeah, I saw that. I think part of it may have been due to UTM trying to pretend to be a game emulator, when everyone knows that’s not what it’s designed to be. I think that tact was pretty dishonest. But I do think it’s unfortunate that Apple rejected it. Though one thing to consider is that just because they rejected that particular app now doesn’t mean they won’t release more secure frameworks for VM apps to use in the future and officially support a more secure implementation. 👍🏻

 

[bill-p]

Yeah, I saw that. I think part of it may have been due to UTM trying to pretend to be a game emulator, when everyone knows that’s not what it’s designed to be. I think that tact was pretty dishonest. But I do think it’s unfortunate that Apple rejected it. Though one thing to consider is that just because they rejected that particular app now doesn’t mean they won’t release more secure frameworks for VM apps to use in the future and officially support a more secure implementation. 👍🏻

No, UTM was not trying to pretend to be anything. We all know what it is. It has been that way forever.

Apple simply just does not want VMs on anything other than Macbooks and desktop Mac computers. Period.

P.S.: this is confirmed by a friend who works at Apple. Apple explicitly does not want any way at all to run another "system" on the iPads currently. Retro emulators are an exception only because they are starting to want more games on iOS systems. They are okay with "streaming" so VNCs and such are allowed but just specifically no other way to execute code on iPads.

Note: there are ways around this even without the App Store involved but we are basically jumping through hoops to get something that was previously allowed.

 

[Kal Madda]

No, UTM was not trying to pretend to be anything. We all know what it is. It has been that way forever.

Apple simply just does not want VMs on anything other than Macbooks and desktop Mac computers. Period.

P.S.: this is confirmed by a friend who works at Apple. Apple explicitly does not want any way at all to run another "system" on the iPads currently. Retro emulators are an exception only because they are starting to want more games on iOS systems. They are okay with "streaming" so VNCs and such are allowed but just specifically no other way to execute code on iPads.

Note: there are ways around this even without the App Store involved but we are basically jumping through hoops to get something that was previously allowed.

They did pretend to be a retro game emulator. This is documented.