Why Do Democrats Eat Their Own?
The title is mine. I am wondering why Democrats are so willing to self-destruct. Here we are again, shades of 2016. Some claiming they will vote for others, the Greens, Libertarians, Socialists, Mickey Mouse, Donald Duck, the family dog, etc. Do we hear much from the Republican constituents about Trump’s very apparent idiosyncrasies? Rare and not picked up by national news and exploited by Democrats.
Angry Bear has its own, “I will vote for others too.” Read on . . .
Author Steven King noted, “This is like listening to your senile uncle at the dinner table after he has that third drink.” (I was also reminded of a classic Grandpa Simpson harangue.)
Why Trump’s weird rant about boats, batteries and sharks matters
MSNBC’s Steve Benen as taken from the Maddow Blog
The presumptive GOP nominee told his followers that “they” are pursuing a policy that would mandate boat manufacturers use electric engines. In fact, Trump, who has long demonstrated a habit of sharing the details of conversations that only occurred in his mind, told the local audience that he’d spoken to an official at a boat company in South Carolina, who told him,
“It’s a problem, sir. They want us to make all-electric boats.”
The former president added that the South Carolinian, who probably doesn’t exist, went on to tell him,
“The problem is the boat is so heavy it can’t float. Also, it can’t go fast because of the weight.”
Trump proceeded to share a variety of details about the practical limitations of requiring boat manufacturers to rely exclusively on battery-powered engines.
~~~
Before we proceed, let’s note for the record that (a) this conversation probably never happened in reality; and (b) there is no policy in place requiring “all-electric boats.”
If we were to stop here, this would simply be a story about Trump telling an unbelievable tall tale about energy policy. Alas, we cannot stop here.
It’s a difficult quote to summarize, so I’ll just go ahead and quote the former president directly:
~~~
“So I said, ‘Let me ask you a question, and [the guy who makes boats in South Carolina] said, ‘Nobody ever asked this question,’ and it must be because of MIT, my relationship to MIT —very smart. He goes, I say, ‘What would happen if the boat sank from its weight? And you’re in the boat and you have this tremendously powerful battery and the battery is now underwater and there’s a shark that’s approximately 10 yards over there?’”
At this point, Trump apparently decided to pursue this tangent in earnest.
“By the way, a lot of shark attacks lately, do you notice that, a lot of sharks?” he asked. “I watched some guys justifying it today. ‘Well, they weren’t really that angry. They bit off the young lady’s leg because of the fact that they were, they were not hungry, but they misunderstood what who she was.’ These people are crazy. He said there’s no problem with sharks. ‘They just didn’t really understand a young woman swimming now.’ It really got decimated and other people do a lot of shark attacks.”
And then he shifted back to his original story.
“So I said, so there’s a shark 10 yards away from the boat, 10 yards or here, do I get electrocuted if the boat is sinking? Water goes over the battery, the boat is sinking. Do I stay on top of the boat and get electrocuted, or do I jump over by the shark and not get electrocuted? Because I will tell you, he didn’t know the answer. He said, ‘You know, nobody’s ever asked me that question.” I said, ‘I think it’s a good question.’ I think there’s a lot of electric current coming through that water. But you know what I’d do if there was a shark or you get electrocuted, I’ll take electrocution every single time. I’m not getting near the shark. So we’re going to end that.”
AB: Hmmmmm . . .
“I don’t belong to an organized party; I’m a Democrat.” Mark Twain
Jack:
Thank you for the remembrance.
I do not believe we have faced candidates like trump a throwback to pre-WWII Germany. Then too, we failed to fix the issue and resorted to appeasement thinking the issue would go away. It has not and it has worsened. Many of the followers believe they will be better off under trump when the opposite is true. trump is there for himself and those who are upper strata economically.
JackD
I think you mean Will Rogers. Or Maybe Rogers was quoting Twain.
btw we have some eating our young going on right here at AB. lotta sharks in the water looking for a chance to soundbite. all hostility. all favorite memes. no actual conversation.
i would guess that [us] Leftists all started out as rebels against authority…which needed to be rebelled against. but now we can’t turn off the rebel drive and, as noted, end up eating our young.
or our old.
Would the standard of an “organized party” include looking the other way about the leader’s infirmity?
Party loyalty, and all!
Breshnev in his dotage comes to mind….
paddy
no. you start out by assuming the worst, and then can’t think about anything else.
Biden has been an effective President.
There are good enough reasons to think the debate does not measure his competence either to govern or to win. Since we have no viable alternative at the moment it is better to wait and see than spend all our political energy demanding he quit. I think you have never been in a real fight that mattered, or..see comment by Ten Bears.
When I first ran into trolls on my own posts i thought they were honest but just misinformed [been a lotta lyin’going on]. their answers to my attempts to correct for the lies convinced me that maybe they were just stupid. their further comments made me think they were just trying to confuse my other readers. after a while i realize they were just there to waste my time and make me mad so they could say..”see how mean he is to me.” I think the last is the general consensus about trolls.
It’s a Gish Gallop: sucking the air out of the room, flooding the zone
Piss people off, turn them off, confuse the issues
It’s the dumbest thing in the world but it really is about something as simple as “owning the libs”
I read the resume.
Not sure it is that good. I look at Palestine, I see genocide Biden arming up the bombers with my money!
I look at the half hearted support for Ukraine, Biden sent them against the Russian minefields with no air support and neglectful engineering, the Ukraine army should never have jumped off. Giving them almost useless Patriots is not reassuring.
I look at fixing social programs: no one is talking them, except here!
I hear about how bad Trump is, and some memes without humor about Trump and “our” democracy.
I heard no reason to select Biden.
The debate was the first interview, I heard no reason to select Biden.
Biden does not get a call back!
So much for the democrat smoke filled room selection process.
Jim Hightower: “If the Gods had meant us to vote they would have given us candidates.”
The Brits got it almost right by sitting out the election. It would have been better if they had voted for fourth party (not Tory, not Labour, not Liberal Democrat) to clearly register their dissent.
John:
Then you own it if you do not get what you want.
coberly gets it right… “Biden has been”
Part of the reason “Democrats eat their own” is that they never get much of a choice. The 2016 primaries were rigged by the DNC and the 2020 primaries were stifled by Biden and the DNC. Even the 2020 primaries were decided in smoke filled rooms before the South Carolian primary when alternatives to Biden were persuaded to accept deals to back off. Yet the Biden partisans expect Democrats to be loyal to whatever they gets foisted on them.
NY Times editors: “For more than a year, voters have made it unquestionably clear in surveys and interviews that they harbor significant doubts about Mr. Biden’s physical and mental fitness for office. Mr. Biden has disregarded the concerns of those voters — his fellow citizens — and put the country at significant risk by continuing to insist that he is the best Democrat to defeat Mr. Trump.” Opinion | The Democratic Party Must Speak the Plain Truth to the President – The New York Times (nytimes.com)
What was needed was a good dose of democracy–put Biden to the test during the primaries. But that was the last thing that Democrats wanted. And now they wonder why voters don’t just knuckle under?
John:
You can not take a phrase from someone else and change it to suit your argument. You can quote it and then say this is what he really means . . . Then it is your interpretation. And you own it. That is about as liberal as I am going to get.
actually it was not what i really meant, but i didn’t think about calling it a lie. just a lazy figure of speech. cute. if you like that sort of thing.
This is more Ed Muskie and ibogaine. Hunter Thompson started the story that Muskie had an ibogaine addiction. Needless to say, the press loved it. Hey, Muskie was a Democrat, so they couldn’t really nail him on policy, but some bogus story could be repeated ad infinitum.
@Jack,
I thought that was Will Rogers.
You and Dale are both right. Also, it’s true.
JackD
thanks for clearing it up…
and it’s still funny.
he also said “There is no permanent criminal class in America…except Congress.
Joel:
I have known Jack for decades now. He was testing us. I ignored it as I was busy writing. You, Dale, and others got it right.
Would that that were true but thanks for the defense, Bill.
JackD
getting it wrong is no big deal. AB is not , or should not be, a competition for omniscience or infallibility.
neither is the Presidency.
coberly:
There can be only one of me.
It’s pretty fouled up that Ex-Repubs and No Party left-leaning independents are putting more effort into keeping the president on the job than his own damned political party. Party’s penchant for snatching defeat out of the jaws of victory?
Joe said it best today (responding to backstabbers): he won the primaries, he has 3,900 delegates, he is The People’s choice. Insiders playing games need sit down
Calls for Biden to step aside are a Republican psyop; dems repeating the call are either 1) fools led around by the nose or 2) Republicans in Democrat’s clothes
Ten
that’s prety much my take. or maybe it’s just that the Pundit class is paid by the ultra wealthy [who seem to own all the media] and since sound-bites is their job they get the people all stampeding in panic.
Trump is relatively quiet because he thinks he wins either way. dissension is the name of his game.
I plan to vote for Biden. He has been an effective president and will be in a second term. But he won the primary because he was the incumbent and no one (who was anyone) was going to choose to run against him.
Arne:
I tend to agree with your analysis. He did the right things economically over the last 3 years plus months. He was sympathetic with the low-income individuals and families. From trump we received the 2017 tax break which mostly benefited those who least need it. He probably wanted it and probably did not understand the mechanics of it and lied about its impact over ten years. A trifecta of ignorance, bull shit, and baloney, his mainstays.
I do detect some bad faith here. For example, several reactions to the ‘what if you lose’ question. What was he supposed to say? I’m going to send drones against Mar-a-Lago? All those states that voted Trump will have their water poisoned? I will pardon in advance anyone who prevents a Trump elector from casting their EV?
Bad faith and, in Stephanopoulos’s case, patronizing.
The amount of electrons spent on this is bordering insane. I guess if people read the stuff, but it’s starting to feel like some kind of obligation to keep in good graces with your social station. “What? You haven’t written your ‘it’s sad because he’s a great man but he needs to reach deep and serve his country by quitting’ article yet? What are you, some kind of MAGA?
Eric,
You talking to me? If so, you misunderstood me. Paul Krugman today said he thinks Biden should step down. Krugman’s expertise on this issue? None. Last time I looked he was an economist. He probably reads the New York Times too much.
Eric
how many electrons did you spend on that comment.
There are about two hundred million voters in this country. Most of them are honest….perhaps badly misled, but honest. So I can understand their worry either way, or the other way.
On the other hand I regard the pundits as either thoroughly dishonest, or just dishonest enough to write glib articles about the scandal of the day, uninformed, except by the politicians and paid non partisan experts, and…it seems…slipping in daggers to prove how sharp they are and win friends and influence people. As for the politicians themselves, see Will Rogers, quoted above.
As I often say, we ended the Great Depression and won World War II with a president in a wheelchair. The guy couldn’t even walk. I suppose that’s why the US Army has an infantry division, someone had to walk to win the war.
Personally, I’d vote for Biden’s rotting corpse over Donald Trump. If nothing else, the stench from the White House would be less noxious.
There was nothing wrong with FDR’s mind!
You will, if Biden’s handlers have their say!
paddy
roosevelts mind.
to be sure, but he let people think he had “a second rate mind” so he could outsmart them without their even noticing they had been had.
but that raises the question: was dresden genocide?
coberly,
Genocide and other war crimes are only done by the losing side!
Bomber Harris, Curtis LeMay etc. would have been hanged if we lost!
paddy says:
July 9, 2024 at 7:27 am
coberly,
Genocide and other war crimes are only done by the losing side!
Bomber Harris, Curtis LeMay etc. would have been hanged if we lost!
paddy says:
July 8, 2024 at 8:35 pm
I read the resume.
Not sure it is that good. I look at Palestine, I see genocide Biden arming up the bombers with my money!
The boat/shark story was a comic interlude, which the alert person figures out from the crowd reaction. No one is required to find it funny, but pointing out that maybe the conversation did not exactly happen is a really weak critique for a comic bit. The electric boat requirement is just a signal about climate change policy – mainly EV cars and trucks – the battery weight swamping it is a reference to some potential impracticalities of some proposed climate policy and the shark is for laughs. The part about sharks not understanding is sort of science; bull sharks in turbid water attack people pretty frequently, but a lot less in clear water. Great whites attack surfers who resemble seals when viewed from below and often spit them out, presumably for taste/texture issues. I feel Democrats mostly would secretly love it if President Biden would riff like this now and then.
A problem with trying to assess the “other” category of voters is the major parties need to start out with a kind of arrogance that those voters are Democrats or Republicans. Mostly they aren’t. Either they actually are members of the Green, Libertarian and etc or are unaffiliated. Partisans of the major parties have an idea of who their voters are and when they find people who “fit the template” reasonably they might call them Democrats or Republicans, but that doesn’t make it so.
Eric:
This was in trash. Not sure why.
~98% of the voters will be Democrat or Republican. The other 2% reflects the “other” voters with the exception of 2016.
I wondered what happened but lack the energy to try to retype it. Trumps humor is odd, but I’m pretty certain he was not actually struggling with true anxiety over electrocution versus shark attacks.
Eric
this is from a famous person. i’ll find the link when i put up the rest of the story.
“Octogenarians have less need to search for themselves; they can pay more attention to what’s around them. You stand at a lectern listening to a man of 78 at another lectern claim to be greater than Washington, Jefferson, or Lincoln, claiming that he won an election by a landslide though he got fewer votes — this is truly amazing. If you were 21, you might think, “Well, this is what politicians do.” When you’re 81, you know this is an absurdity and politicians mostly stay away from the absurd. They don’t campaign by yodeling while riding unicycles and carrying ferrets on their shoulders and wearing a cap with a revolving red light. They try to make sense.
Longevity is getting longer thanks to medical progress, more people hitting their nineties, which means that you can do dumb things well into your seventies and still have time to recover. Donald Trump could still become a decent modest human being and learn to tell a joke. I truly believe this.
re coberly says:
July 9, 2024 at 12:16 pm
Eric
famous person who wrote that was Garrison Keilor. I copied it from Reader Supported News. no link, you can find it if you need it.
just a signal about climate change policy. that’s why it’s not funny.
the aside about the science of shark behavior did not inspire me to take you seriously.
now, what about the bleach? what about “don’t be too gentle with her?” what about…
paddy
and JohnH
you don’t seem to like Biden so why do you care? because you think he can’t beat trump? do you have any objective reason why anyone else out there can beat Trump at ths stage? or do you just want to pile on the Biden too old meme since it is working so well for Trump.
I have no objective knowledge myself for or against the dirty tricks you mention. It wouldn’t surprise me. But Benrie wasn’t going to beat Trump, and black people, for example, knew that. they may also have had doubts about Bernies ability to actually govern…remember Carter? for me the issue now is Beat Trump.
As for the rest of Biden’s crimes against humanity. I agree about the inadequate defense of Ukraine. I would have had the entire USAF on the Ukraine border when Putin started his “routine exercise.” at first I thought Biden’s answer might be better than mine, given doubts about Putin’s sanity and his threats about nuking the world. But I think there is a middle way yet that has not been tried. maybe they are preparing to do it. they don’t tell me.
As for Palestine… I don’t think Biden can stop Israel from doing what it thinks is defending itself. I don’t think it would be wise for him to make a statement by cutting off weapons to Israel. the whole Mideast is an unstable mess, and we don’t need to add to it by making the terrorists think we have abandoned Israel.
I wouldlike to be able to say I am as opposed to genocide..or even one death..as you are….but having seen more death than i thought i could stand, and “genocide” being what all countries do when at war….Ithink I would not risk a worse war in order to preserve my anti-genocide pretensions. make of that what you will, the real danger for US at the moment is Trump,
and what i have seen of “progressives” makes me wonder how far their pacifism really extends. my guess is only as far as they can use it to cry shame on the people who actually have to defend them.
makes me sound like a war criminal, I know. but I think i can still see a difference.
sum of long story: your case against Biden is not convincing to me. and the “democrats” who want to get rid of him look to me like…well, like Ten Bears says.
I sort of like my country.
Of course, the bureaucracy will run my country with a figure head!
Do you think the USAF officer thoroughly screened to go along with blowing up the world could take his football and run if he thought the boss a “bit crackers”?
paddy
actually, yes. that’s the way it is supposed to work. loss of motor skills and speech function is not the same as crackers. and in the crackers sweepstakes Trump is far ahead of Biden.
Since you are involved, I will reply here to
TEF @ 11:37
based on what i have seen around this pool I would say that you and Paddy have been suffering from progressive cognitive decline since you were three. And I am not even a doctor. What gives you away is your one-armed analysis of every issue that comes up.
cob or lee,
I thought your problem was not able to find the shift key.
But I see projection now
paddy
actually my problem is that i am a cockroach and have to jomp on the keys one at a time to type. you can read more about this affliction in Don Marquis “Archie and Mehitible” written a long time ago.
i also note you don’t use caps for your own name.
care to explain what you see as projection?
Jack D: Ran out of replies but not talking about anyone here, just the American media plus what I call political celebrities like Rob Reiner. Two academics specializing in First Ladies even had to chime in. Feels like some kind of instructions from somewhere are to write it up quick. Anne Applebaum for goodness sakes felt she had to say something.
Ah, yes, the American media. Just saw a report from Lawrence O’Donnell on MSNBC that the hoo-hah about the neurologist visiting the White House hyped by the NYT turns out to be a nothing burger. The Doctor made public a memo that the last time he examined Biden was in February in connection with his annual physical and he had nothing neurologically significant in his findings. He has visited the White House on other occasions to examine or treat other White House or military personnel. The New York Times seems to be trying to compete with Fox.
Kindly review democrat Dr. Tom Pitts (neurologist) recent comments on #46’s progressive cognitive and motor disorder. Youtube NBC news.
Did Dr. Pitts examine the president?
A man at a swimming pool is observed to be missing an arm on several occasions by a physician. The physician comments that the man is missing an arm. A friend of the man adamantly claims the physician can’t make that observation because he hasn’t examined him. Progressive motor, speech, and cognitive decline in #46 is as observable as a missing arm.
@TEF,
Any physician who claims to diagnose dementia based on TV clips without ever seeing the patient in the clinic is engaged in malpractice. Telepathic medicine is quackery, full stop.
@TEF,
Baloney!
I read somewhere your kind brews vodka out of jet fuel
Is that true ?
Vodka is pretty hard to get right! I know a couple of Chem E’s who decided to go into distilling they flubbed on many attempts!
Send recipe!
some people at a college near me in 1965 or so made some prety good moonshine. definitely not vodka. or maybe they bought it locally.
ain’t paid no whisky tax since 1792.
eventually i went to gradute school down the road from Shays rebellion and had cause to think about “no taxation without representation.” i don’t know why the whiskey makers didn’t think of passing the tax on to the customers.
got an answer to that from Wiki. and a lot of other details that might make you favorite memes look less convincing if you pay attention.
@paddy,
LOL! Vodka is basically just alcohol and water. Before I moved from Missouri, I played a couple gigs near Godfrey IL, and afterwards, they passed around some local moonshine. It’s a beverage, a fuel and a cleaning agent.
Each time I visited Moscow, my hosts gifted me a fifth of vodka. Blindfolded, I’m sure I couldn’t tell the difference between Russian vodka and Missouri moonshine.
must hav been better than American water and alcohol. Or Missouri hasn’t learned the secrets of Western Massachusetts or North Florida, but I assume the product I tasted was thunder roaded in from further north. It’s probably why the North won the Civil War. That Missouri hooch will make you crazy. or blind.
Eric
so we agree about the media. but as far as i can guess your media is not the same as mine.
Will the press conference on Thursday 11 July be definitive? #46 has a millstone around the neck that has already caused ‘elite’ big donor supporters to exit. Over the next 4 months, this millstone will be the repetitively leveraged and exploited by the opposition. A current July 2024 37-38 % presidential approval rating at this stage of political season has never resulted in an incumbent winning a presidential election. Add that millstone to it. A continuation on the current path will likely result in a catastrophic defeat with loss of both the house and senate in November. A fresh new ticket would shed that millstone and other baggage. A fresh new ticket would offer hope and allow directed focus on the very critical issues facing America. A fresh new ticket would likely result in a blue landslide.
TEF
so you and the NYT say. i have no reason to think you are right.
some of us think the way to win a war does not begin by killing your leader.
So far, the part of the “media” I read seems to be coming around to my point of view.
grrr.
that last bit was put in by my dog. i helped because his typing skills are worse than mine. but he is a much better judge of character than i am.
@ TEF,
That approval rating you are flogging is the result of pollsters talking to people who will answer their telephones when they don’t know who is calling. As an article in Slate magazine pointed out, most people don’t answer their phones when they don’t know the caller. So who are the pollsters’ respondents representative of? Why are they reflecting the attitudes of people in general. Why have the polls for the last 10 years or so been non predictive? In other words the data is garbage. If it seems to be predictive in a particular instance, that’s pure chance.