User talk:Valjean

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This user is aware of the designation of the following topics as contentious topics: post-1992 politics of the United States and closely related people climate change pseudoscience and fringe science He should not be given alerts for those areas.

This page has been mentioned by multiple media organizations: Ashe Schow (November 25, 2015). "Wikipedia founder advocates for updating policies following 'The Hunting Ground' controversy". Washington Examiner. Retrieved February 8, 2020. Another editor, whose username is BullRangifer, suggested Wikipedia not become "a kangaroo court or lynching" by rushing to ban accounts who break COI. BullRangifer suggested following seven steps to determine whether "The Hunting Ground" crew member should be banned and whether his edits should be removed. Some of the steps included how he handled questions related to his edits and whether he stuck to discussion pages to ask for edits rather than making them himself. Marcus Gilmer (October 3, 2018). "Wikipedia demotes Breitbart to fake news". Mashable. Retrieved October 5, 2018. Support. If anything, it's even more unreliable than the Daily Mail, as they at least use trained journalists, whereas Breitbart is a fringe propaganda organization which lets its extreme partisan bias get in the way of how it reports things, and whether it does so, just as Fox News does. It too should be deprecated, but let's start with Breitbart (and InfoWars). — BullRangifer 17:51, 8 September 2018 (UTC) Alexander Hall (August 13, 2020). "Report: Wikipedia Editors Censoring Evidence Supporting Michael Flynn". NewsBusters. Retrieved August 15, 2020. Liberal user Valjean responded by condemning this revelation as "conspiracy theories" and "part of a cover-up," even "when it comes from the now-sitting government of the USA." Valjean specified that "Nothing coming from Trump's Justice Department, FBI, CIA, anything, can be trusted." Breitbart alleged that Valjean, formerly under the name "BullRangifer" has been "previously involved in slanting articles about the Russia investigation."

Keep your chin up. Rainbow's are most beautiful after storms. --ARoseWolf 18:37, 29 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the kind words. It's tough when I have a guillotine hanging over my neck. Does keeping my chin up increase or decrease the ability of the blade to strike my neck? That ANI is a piling on clusterfuck of bad faith, but there are some people who are seeing it for what it is. I still have not been provided an example of the claimed BLP violations in the draft article, a claim that started the MfD. Still accusations with no evidence. And my request for evidence of that unproven claim is called "bludgeoning" and led to the ANI, which has been continued without a demand for evidence. How can that happen? Accusations without evidence are considered a civility violation, but nothing happens.

I can "almost" see rainbows in the huge clouds of smoke from the Park Fire. (That's another stress right now.) The colors at night are actually beautiful. The clouds of smoke are lit up by the light from the fire. We go out and take pictures. -- Valjean (talk) (PING me) 19:08, 29 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'll echo ARoseWolf's words. A guillotine, indeed (do follow that link, if you haven't seen it already). But there is plenty of pushback to the accusations, and I'm pretty sure they aren't getting traction, just a lot of unhelpful noise. --Tryptofish (talk) 21:04, 29 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I hope you're right. There is a lack of accountability here. Nickps should be held accountable for making accusations without providing any evidence, and then attacking me and abusing ANI instead of providing the requested evidence. That's egregious behavior worthy of a trouting and one-way interaction ban. He needs to stay away from me and the draft (in fact all drafts in userspace), and even get a topic ban from the topic of the draft. -- Valjean (talk) (PING me) 21:20, 29 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Don't count on that to happen. I'm guessing it will get closed with no action taken against anyone, and if that happens, you should regard it as a victory. --Tryptofish (talk) 21:26, 29 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, I can see that happening. No justice here. I don't have much confidence in dramaboards here. Justice is often lacking. They tend to be kangaroo courts. -- Valjean (talk) (PING me) 21:37, 29 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I've just said that I'll work with you to fix the issues that editors see, and I think it will resolve with that. Let's work together on that. (As for the drama, yeah, it's bad, but remember – it's only a website.) --Tryptofish (talk) 22:22, 29 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'd take the assistance. Don't look for justice because you are right, there is no justice here or anywhere for that matter. I don't worry about what is said off-wiki. I don't usually discuss Wikipedia off-wiki. There is nothing you can do about what is said on WPO. Some of it, I'm sure, is just hate and drama but there are nuggets of truth in everything that is said and things you can take away from this and that discussion to improve you as an editor. It's not easy. I've been disillusioned with Wikipedia for some time now and I doubt it would be any different on WPO given what I have experienced of it.

My disillusion has only grown with recent discussions I've been in. But I realized something yesterday when I was reading the AN/I about you and correlating to to my own experiences. The most fulfilling experience we have is when we hit the publish button and a new article we helped manufacture is now in space online forever. It may be AfD'd next week but it is in the history somewhere and recoverable.

After a particularly frustrating discussion recently I dug in my heels and finished Wild River (Alaska), an article I had been working on for sometime but lost sight of when I got involved with a RfC on Andrew Jackson. I had forgotten the thrill of trying to find sources to match what I already know firsthand. I was mostly disappointed (not many sources for my remote location) but even that was refreshing. I wasn't angry or disgusted. There was no drama. Just me and a river I know very well. There is healing in that. Val, find your healing place, whether that's on Wiki or off. Then come here, work with Tryp, and become an even better editor. You don't have to be a victim of anything, even the injustice found online. The power is inside you, that much I do know, because I see and hear it. I'm still trying to master mine. --ARoseWolf 11:15, 30 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks to both of you for your support, kindness, and advice. I don't want favoritism, just a fair shake and straight talk, and I appreciate that you do it with kindness and good faith. That's wonderful.

Tryptofish, I will definitely accept any help you are willing to offer. Can we do that on the talk page of the draft, or should we do it somewhere else? -- Valjean (talk) (PING me) 13:42, 30 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'd be happy to do that, and yes, I think the draft page talk page would be fine. At some point, probably not right away, I might try a significant rewrite myself, letting you know when I'm starting and stopping. I'll need some time before I can really do very much, so I'd like to take it slow. (By the way, I looked at WPO, and they switched to freaking out about me, and then moved on to the editor who joked about Rodney Dangerfield. They really freaked out! I get a kick out of trolling the trolls. Such a droll way to turn the tables.) --Tryptofish (talk) 16:48, 30 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with everything, including you taking a turn at using the source material (and any more you might find) in other creative ways. I suggest that you create your version in a subpage so we keep them separate. Pinging will be essential. I'm still in the beginning phase of my typical way of creating articles. I start with a lot and end up with a lot less. See these notes where I describe My article creation process. -- Valjean (talk) (PING me) 17:13, 30 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

As long as you watchlist the draft and its talkpage, do you need me to also ping you? --Tryptofish (talk) 17:16, 30 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That may be good enough. Go for it. -- Valjean (talk) (PING me) 17:45, 30 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]