David Strathairn’s Unforgettable Performance In This PBS Film Will Ensure That You ‘Remember This’

David Strathairn got his start in the theater, but his career took a dramatic upswing when he stepped in front of the camera for the 1980 film Return of the Secaucus 7, written and directed by his fellow Williams College alumnus, John Sayles. The twosome would go on to collaborate on numerous additional projects over the years, but Strathairn’s career as an actor has gone well beyond his work with Sayles, stretching into television as well.

Indeed, Strathairn has forged a filmography that’s filled with a plethora of different projects, far too many to cover definitively in a single conversation. That said, when Decider had the opportunity to hop on the phone with Strathairn, he was kind enough to field a few questions about some of his past gigs — among them Temple Grandin, The Expanse, and L.A. Confidential — while pointedly underlining the importance and the social relevancy of his latest endeavor, Remember This, which airs this week as part of PBS’s Great Performances.

DECIDER: First of all, let me say that it’s nice to see you in black and white again. 

DAVID STRATHAIRN: [Laughs.] Yeah, they don’t often make things in black and white anymore!

I know your history with this material in general goes back many years, but one moment that I know was very important for you was seeing Shoah in the theater, which… I mean, that takes considerable stamina on a couple of different levels.

Indeed. Yes, it was quite an event, a singular event for me.

I’d read about its length [9 hours and 26 minutes] for years before I knew anything about the film beyond its title, and the length alone was intimidating, but then to find out about its subject matter… To see it in the theater is a feat of emotional endurance as well.

It was quite an accomplishment on [director Claude] Lanzmann’s part, and I think seminal in its way, as far as bearing witness to the event and from those perspectives that he had at his disposal. Yeah it’s an incredible document. Unfortunately, a lot of people may have heard about it but haven’t seen it. It’s kind of a thing that’s sort of hanging there in the wings. But I hope our production, this little film, will maybe tweak some people to either revisit it or visit it on a first-time basis in order to appreciate its potency and its message.

You’ve obviously played more than a few real people over the years, but Karski is definitely an emotional rollercoaster of a performance. How much research did you do for the role beyond what was provided to you?

We had an extraordinary amount of research available to us: all of his speeches; the book by E. Thomas Wood, Karski: How One Man Tried to Stop the Holocaust; his own novel, Story of a Secret State. And what was really special for all of us — and I’m speaking of the director, Derek Goldman, and the writer, Clark Young — was that we had firsthand anecdotal information from his students, from people who knew him in his time in Georgetown. That was just really insightful and invaluable. Throughout the journey, whenever we’ve done [the play], we’ve met people who knew him, who knew of him, and shared their stories. So we had a lot going for us. 

I know the play originally was an ensemble kind of thing, but I don’t actually know at what point it became a one-man show.

[Laughs.] I forget myself the particular moment when it happened! But the reason it sort of evolved to that was a very simple one: we wanted the audience to sort of be in the classroom, so to speak, with Karski as the professor, and to take away that fourth wall that often exists when there are other characters and the story is being told within the confines of that. So we felt that, well, this is honoring his legacy as a professor, and it also — as we had been told by the audiences — makes for much more of a direct experience, a visceral, personal experience, to have him talking to him directly, so to speak. So that’s why it evolved to the one-man performance that it is.

How was the experience of performing it on camera as opposed to in front of an audience? Not that you can usually see your audience anyway, but you can certainly hear them.

Well, I’d done it several times before we got to the camera, so it kind of felt the same. There’s not much difference between doing in front of an audience and doing it front of the five or six crew members that were there in the studio. 

I must say that the cinematography for the film is incredible.

Oh, I’m glad you mentioned that. I really think it’s quite beautiful. It’s quite imaginative, having that black backdrop and then the whiteness and the blackness going back and forth, giving a feeling of what he was going through. You know, using the black backdrop when he was going through the Warsaw ghetto and the transit camp, and his journey through all of that. And then when it comes white… Yeah, I thought that was a brilliant choice on the part of Jeff Hutchens, the cinematographer (and co-director of the film).

Of course, there are many films out there that have told the story of the Holocaust and the events leading up to it, but for those potentially entering into this film, what would you say makes this particular version of the story stand out?

I think it’s because it’s such a personal presentation. It’s just one man recounting his experience and his personal reportage, such as it is. He was extraordinarily performative in his classroom, people tell us, and he was also as extraordinarily objective about the experience. So other than, like, documentaries like Ken Burns’ brilliant documentary or other films about the Holocaust where the information and the experiences are being presented in a wider scope, this one… You’re listening directly to one person, and I think it has — and hopefully will remain to have — a visceral emotional punch as well as all of the information and the historical documenting of the time. But, yeah, it’s the personal direct address to an audience who I feel is in the room with me, in more ways than just being audience. Since they’re being directly addressed, that creates a different kind of chemistry in the room. 

Yeah, at times, there’s that feeling that you can’t look away, if only because there are moments where it feels like you’re making eye contact.

Well, they can look away if they want. [Laughs.] But I can’t.

Well, hopefully they won’t, either! 

Indeed.

I wanted to ask you about a few projects from your back catalog, not least of which because, when I mentioned on social media that I was going to be talking to you, I was bombarded with a flurry of people posting your past roles and saying, “Ask about this!” But the first one I wanted to ask about – Temple Grandin – is kind of a personal one for me, because I actually interviewed Temple when you were all attending the TCA Press Tour for the film.

Yes, I heard that you did! I was just enthralled and entranced by what Claire Danes was doing. Just a transformative performance. When I did meet Temple — briefly, unfortunately, but had the good fortune to meet her — I was just astounded by… Well, by Temple herself, but how Claire had inhabited her and was presenting her in such a sincere way and with such clarity. I hardly felt like I was there as Dr. Carlock. Also, how the director managed to somehow create the sense of Temple’s vision and perspective of the world, I thought that was very clever. Yeah, I just felt like I was really fortunate to be involved in that. But as for trying to remember what I was actually doing… I guess that’s good when you’re so taken out of yourself and entranced by your fellow performer!

My wife is an ABA therapist, and she was given a copy of Temple Grandin’s book when she first started working with her boss, and there was a little post-it in the book that said, “Not everyone has the temperament for this job, but you do.” And that’s basically what she’s been doing ever since.

That’s nice. Good for her!

I know your relationship with John Sayles goes back to college, but do you actually remember the moment you met him, or was a moment that only really mattered in retrospect? 

I remember meeting him at college, passingly. He was involved in a couple of experimental theater productions at the college that I was involved with peripherally. But I really got to know him later, when he came to the summer theater in New Hampshire where a lot of us were trying to learn the ways of the theater. And then he directed and performed there, and then he wrote [Return of the] Secaucus 7 and filmed it after the summer theater season was over.

Of the films that you’ve done with him, which are plentiful, is there one in particular that you think was the most underrated?

Oh, interesting question. Well, it sounds as if all of them were underrated! [Laughs.] There are several that I know people haven’t seen. Men with Guns is one film I think is really pretty special, and nobody ever talks about that. So that may be one that not only hasn’t been seen but is underrated. I…don’t know. Matewan is highly rated and respected. But there are so many there that… I don’t know, I wouldn’t say that any of them are underrated, in my opinion. But the fact that they aren’t out there in the firmament as maybe some others are, that’s kind of sad. But for those who know him and know his work, all of his films are highly rated.

Are you aware of just how much of a fanbase Sneakers continues to have to this day? I think it was the one that got mentioned more than anything. “Ask him about playing Whistler!” 

[Laughs.] Yeah, every once in awhile, someone will come up to me and mention Sneakers! And it reminds me what a special little film that was, considering the time it was done, what it was about, and the amazing cast that Phil Robinson put together. Yeah, a lot of people say that’s one of their favorites, and that’s nice to hear.

I will say that I really wish that The Days and Nights of Molly Dodd was out there streaming (officially) somewhere.

Well, that’s another seminal kind of series that Jay Tarses put together. An amazing cast of characters and New York actors. The writing, I think, was really cutting edge. And to have a heroine like Blair [Brown] was… I thought that was pretty special. Kind of a seminal series, in my opinion.

I think it’s viewed as one of the first real half-hour dramedies.

Exactly, yeah. 

Did you ever expect that you’d become a sci-fi star, as you have with your work on Alphas and The Expanse?

Well, you’re being generous saying I’m a sci-fi star. [Laughs.] I wouldn’t consider myself a star. One and a half attempts at a sci-fi world is kind of meager and doesn’t really necessitate or qualify as being a star! But I loved being in The Expanse. I thought that was also really wonderfully produced, and the way they took the novels and adapted them. Yeah, I just kind of pinch myself at being able to be part of that.

Alphas, unfortunately, got kind of short shrift. It didn’t make it past two seasons. I thought it was a great idea, a wonderful conceit of these characters, these people with special skills, so to speak, who kind of became… I don’t know, Marvel heroes? [Laughs.] But not. Just sort of normal, ordinary people with particular eccentricities. Unfortunately, it didn’t go on for very long, but I had a good time playing on that.

A friend of mine says that every time he watches Lincoln, he’s amused by your performance as Seward. He said, “Every time Abe launches into a folksy anecdote, David is there in the background, trying to not to roll his eyes.”

[Laughs.] Well, I don’t know how much Seward rolled his eyes when he was in the presence of Lincoln. It was a very potent and complex relationship. But I was perhaps being caught off-guard, rolling my eyes in amazement at what Daniel Day-Lewis was doing. 

That could be. I know we’re in the home stretch here, but what do you recall about the experience of making Mother Night?

Mother Night! Yeah, wow, amazing you brought that up. I have…vague memories of that. Um… Yeah, I don’t know as I can elaborate much on that. I have vague memories. It was interesting working with Nick Nolte at that time in his career, but… Really, it’s still sort of back in the fog bank right now.

Well, I’ll try an alternate one as a back-up: what about The River Wild?

Oh, The River Wild was just so much fun. Everything about it was just a wonderful experience. 

That obviously wasn’t the last time you worked with Curtis Hanson, but was it the first time?

That was it, yeah.

I presume that didn’t hurt in regards to your ending up in L.A. Confidential.

Yeah, I don’t know if that’s how that came by. Well, no, actually, I do know how it came by: it came in at the eleventh hour and, quite frankly, I think Curtis called me up and said that he lost his first or second or maybe even his third choice, and would I do him a favor and play Pierce Patchett? He said, “Can you come out here in a couple of days and do it?” And I said, “Well, sure, Curtis! Thanks!” [Laughs.] And thereby hangs that tale!

Do you have a favorite project that you’ve worked on over the years that didn’t get the love you thought it deserved?

Um… Wow, let me think for a minute. That’s a good question. [Long pause.] Not from a personal perspective. I always feel that being involved in films like John Sayles’ films, I get all the love that one could just by being in those productions. But thinking about which film may not have been given its full breath and due… I don’t know, it’s hard to think. Maybe City of Hope? That’s one that I know that people who do know the film really like it. For what it was about, and the whole landscape of that film, I think it hasn’t been given its full due in terms of its sociological, civic soul. That’s one that’s coming to mind. I’m sure there are others if I gave it more thought, but we’d be on the phone too long. [Laughs.]

Well, in the realm of your TV work, I’d definitely nominate Big Apple. 

Oh, Big Apple! Yeah, I don’t know, that was destined to be something pretty special, I think, given the writer [David Milch] and Ed O’Neill and all the other characters in there. But that thing just sort of… The rug was pulled out from underneath it really kind of suddenly, and it caught us all off-guard. I mean, for sure, that would’ve been up there in the panoply of the great David Milch productions and the great cop/detective shows, without a doubt.

Yeah, I talked to Ed several years back, and you could tell it still annoyed him that it didn’t take off. And understandably so, when you consider that cast: you and him, plus Michael Madsen, Glynn Turman, Titus Welliver, Donnie Wahlberg… It’s hard to conceive that it didn’t go anywhere. Maybe it’s because it was on network rather than cable. Who knows?

I have no idea. It’s just one of those things where it’s a roll of the dice, I guess.

To wrap up, I wanted to bring it back to Karski. What would you like people to take away from Remember This? Because certainly there’s more than a little bit of relevancy to current events in the mix.

[Bursts out laughing.] Just a little bit! Yeah, more than a little bit, indeed. I mean, as we’ve journeyed with this piece, we’ve found that that’s something we really hope that audiences will take away: that this is not only a historical document, but also a current-events piece, and that in the lessons of Jan Karski, there are so many things that people can think about in terms of what we’re going through today, in terms of disinformation and alliedship and the rise of oppression and injustice and things around the world.

I think one thing that we’ve talked about several times is the concept of insignificance, that Karski said of himself that he was an insignificant little man. And throughout his life, until his death, he felt that he had failed in some fashion. And we hope that this film, this history, counters those concepts of insignificance and failure, because he was not insignificant by dint of what he did. In many ways, at the moment he may have failed to convince Roosevelt or Frankfurter or Churchill or any of the other powerbrokers of the world at that time to do something, he didn’t fail in his becoming an exemplary human in the concept of bearing witness and accepting one’s civic responsibility to look out for his fellow man.

So we hope that that — plus much more, but at least that — comes across, and that people can take that away. And maybe it will inspire, encourage, and ignite an effort on our part as seemingly insignificant people who may feel that we are failing in making the world a better place. Yeah, that’s what we hope. All along, that was our original intention: to present this as an educational piece, something to give to the next generation as some way to conceptualize and acknowledge what’s going on in their lives on so many levels. [Pauses.] I know that’s a long ramble.

But a solid ramble, and a wonderful way to sum things up.

[Laughs.] Okay, great. I’m glad.

Will Harris (@NonStopPop) has a longstanding history of doing long-form interviews with random pop culture figures for the A.V. Club, Vulture, and a variety of other outlets, including Variety. He’s currently working on a book with David Zucker, Jim Abrahams, and Jerry Zucker. (And don’t call him Shirley.)